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WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn
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SethB
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:35 pm |
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Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:02 pm Posts: 818 Location: downtown Mpls
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bensdad wrote: SethB wrote: I'd much rather have him sitting at home (or in his office) searching the Internet for kiddie porn than going to elementary school playgrounds to abduct actual children to abuse. I'd rather he (they) stop creating a market for kiddie porn. Every child he viewed in pics and vids was someone's real-life victim. This fuck helped create the market. So how do you feel about the laws that define a photoshopped picture of a willing (paid) 20-year-old model to be kiddie porn? Who is the "victim" in that case?
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340PD
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:39 pm |
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Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:02 pm Posts: 188 Location: Saint Paul
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DeanC wrote: I guess I'll be skipping the Caesar's for lunch today. How about for the rest of my life! I really wished I had not watched that. As was suggested, this guy needs to be put into Gen Pop and between liking children and being a cop he should have a very interesting time in prison. Sadly, I don't think they put former officers in general population. I could be wrong but I don't think they do.
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bensdad
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:51 pm |
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Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 9:55 pm Posts: 598 Location: Dundas, Minnesota
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SethB wrote: bensdad wrote: SethB wrote: I'd much rather have him sitting at home (or in his office) searching the Internet for kiddie porn than going to elementary school playgrounds to abduct actual children to abuse. I'd rather he (they) stop creating a market for kiddie porn. Every child he viewed in pics and vids was someone's real-life victim. This fuck helped create the market. So how do you feel about the laws that define a photoshopped picture of a willing (paid) 20-year-old model to be kiddie porn? Who is the "victim" in that case? It is my understanding, and I'd be happy to be corrected on this if I'm wrong, that in order to be prosecuted for possession of child porn, it is the duty of the state to prove that the pics on your hard-drive contain ACTUAL children. My response was not about your mythical 20-year-old. I said this: Quote: Every child he viewed I do have a pretty strong feeling/sense that most of the females in the sex industry are past or present victims of sex abuse. However, that has nothing to do with this case (unless I missed something, and he was actually looking at pics of adult models made to look like children).
_________________ I say I'm cleaning guns... My wife says I'm petting them.
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SethB
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 7:38 am |
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Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:02 pm Posts: 818 Location: downtown Mpls
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bensdad wrote: It is my understanding, and I'd be happy to be corrected on this if I'm wrong, that in order to be prosecuted for possession of child porn, it is the duty of the state to prove that the pics on your hard-drive contain ACTUAL children. My response was not about your mythical 20-year-old. I said this: Quote: Every child he viewed I do have a pretty strong feeling/sense that most of the females in the sex industry are past or present victims of sex abuse. However, that has nothing to do with this case (unless I missed something, and he was actually looking at pics of adult models made to look like children). UC Code Title 18 Part 1 Chapter 110 Section 2256 (8) “child pornography” means any visual depiction, including any photograph, film, video, picture, or computer or computer-generated image or picture, whether made or produced by electronic, mechanical, or other means, of sexually explicit conduct, where— (A) the production of such visual depiction involves the use of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct; (B) such visual depiction is a digital image, computer image, or computer-generated image that is, or is indistinguishable from, that of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct; or (C) such visual depiction has been created, adapted, or modified to appear that an identifiable minor is engaging in sexually explicit conduct. Note (B) and (C). No actual child necessary. In fact, I'll give an even more extreme example: a 22-year-old male (very skilled with Photoshop) starts with a picture of himself. (I'm not aware of any actual cases of that, but the law is clear.)
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Dick Unger
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:13 am |
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Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 2:54 am Posts: 2444 Location: West Central MN
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I have a hard time making a felony crime out of someone looking at pictures. I guess we don't have a way to determine a person's thoghts, if we did, I suppose it'd be a crime to even think about kiddies sex.
Lot's of folks probably imagine criminal activity, but normally we just intervene if they actually do something besides having immoral or illegal thoughts.
I hate idea of a cop (or anyone) sitting at home looking at naked pictures with his tongue and other appendage hanging out, but I'd don't know if we should wreck his life for that. I assume very few of these folks ever get caught, or ever act out.
I don't like the porn industry, or "politcal consultants" who are hired to spread obvious lies (think the Nixon "rat fuckers" that industry has obviously grown since then), but I have a hard time with these laws about thoughts. I think it's just morallity. Go after the porn maker for using children, and if you can't catch the porn maker, then, well, you can't.
The marketplace of ideas (sexual or other ideas) is messy, so is democracy, and free enterprise capitalism. Stuff we don't like happens. it's how we decided to live, a tradeoff for individual freedom.
Policing thoughts is wrong. I realize he supports the porn industry, but It's like blaming depositers for bank robbery. Someday it'll be illegal to have more than a small amount of cash, because that encourages robbers.
We can't control people's minds. I'd bet the internet porn laws don't reduce kiddie sex at all.
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bensdad
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:45 am |
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Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 9:55 pm Posts: 598 Location: Dundas, Minnesota
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I value liberty over safety. I also get caught in the act of having double standards sometimes. This is one of those times. Should a person be prosecuted for viewing pictures? Bensdad says no. Should a person be prosecuted for viewing pictures? Bensdad (who is also Taylor's dad) says yes.
_________________ I say I'm cleaning guns... My wife says I'm petting them.
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Jeremiah
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 2:10 pm |
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Raving Moderate |
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Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 12:46 pm Posts: 1292 Location: Minneapolis
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Fair answer, that. It's a minefield- where do we draw the line? But thanks for putting it so succinctly.
_________________ I'm liberal, pro-choice, and I carry a gun. Any questions?
My real name is Jeremiah (go figure).
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bensdad
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:38 pm |
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Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 9:55 pm Posts: 598 Location: Dundas, Minnesota
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Jeremiah wrote: Fair answer, that. It's a minefield- where do we draw the line? But thanks for putting it so succinctly. Don't know. Got kids? Go outside and play a little ball with them. Mull this "line" over while you're at it. Lemme know what you come up with, cuz I seriously do... not... know. As I tried to point out, having kids changes ones perspective on this issue and many others. In fact, I used to be a pro-choice liberal. Heck, I voted for Clinton.
_________________ I say I'm cleaning guns... My wife says I'm petting them.
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Jeremiah
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:12 am |
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Raving Moderate |
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Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 12:46 pm Posts: 1292 Location: Minneapolis
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bensdad wrote: Jeremiah wrote: Fair answer, that. It's a minefield- where do we draw the line? But thanks for putting it so succinctly. Don't know. Got kids? Go outside and play a little ball with them. Mull this "line" over while you're at it. Lemme know what you come up with, cuz I seriously do... not... know. As I tried to point out, having kids changes ones perspective on this issue and many others. In fact, I used to be a pro-choice liberal. Heck, I voted for Clinton. I don't- though I work with them every day, and have a few "nieces and nephews" I see more often than some members of my real family. I don't pretend I know exactly what having children feels like, but I think I might have some idea. I've got no answers either- I just was impressed by the way you phrased your post, and your willingness to admit a certain amount of double-standard. I used to be a "pro-choice liberal", too. Now I'm a "pro-choice, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving moderate".
_________________ I'm liberal, pro-choice, and I carry a gun. Any questions?
My real name is Jeremiah (go figure).
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bensdad
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 8:08 am |
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Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 9:55 pm Posts: 598 Location: Dundas, Minnesota
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Quote: I've got no answers either- I just was impressed by the way you phrased your post, and your willingness to admit a certain amount of double-standard. I used to be a "pro-choice liberal", too. Now I'm a "pro-choice, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving moderate". Hey! That's me!! (well, almost). I'm a "Pro-life, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving Libertarian." This discussion about the porno-cop really is at the heart of the matter. I believe (bet you do, too) that a persons rights extend to the outstretched arms of their neighbor. Did this guy mess with anyone elses world? That's the only real question. He didn't directly cause any damage I guess. I'm just gigantically afraid of what he has the potential to become. You've outed me as a witch-hunter. Thanks a lot.
_________________ I say I'm cleaning guns... My wife says I'm petting them.
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Jeremiah
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 9:41 am |
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Raving Moderate |
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Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 12:46 pm Posts: 1292 Location: Minneapolis
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bensdad wrote: Quote: I've got no answers either- I just was impressed by the way you phrased your post, and your willingness to admit a certain amount of double-standard. I used to be a "pro-choice liberal", too. Now I'm a "pro-choice, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving moderate". Hey! That's me!! (well, almost). I'm a "Pro-life, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving Libertarian." This discussion about the porno-cop really is at the heart of the matter. I believe (bet you do, too) that a persons rights extend to the outstretched arms of their neighbor. Did this guy mess with anyone elses world? That's the only real question. He didn't directly cause any damage I guess. I'm just gigantically afraid of what he has the potential to become. You've outed me as a witch-hunter. Thanks a lot. Yup- I'm in total agreement about the outstretched arms. As a matter of fact, I agree with all of it. As someone who works with kids (and whose career would come to a screeching halt in circumstances anything remotely like porno-cop's), it scares me, too. I kind of think there's two parallel questions here- what do we do with a person (Joe or Jane Average) in this circumstance, and what do we do with someone (a cop, a teacher, etc.) in a position of public trust in this circumstance? A witch hunter? Naw, you seem far too reasonable (both here and in person) for that. A caring, concerned teacher and parent? Yes- and I'm guessing you'd be "outed" as that with pride.
_________________ I'm liberal, pro-choice, and I carry a gun. Any questions?
My real name is Jeremiah (go figure).
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mrokern
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 9:50 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:40 pm Posts: 2264 Location: Eden Prairie
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bensdad wrote: Quote: I've got no answers either- I just was impressed by the way you phrased your post, and your willingness to admit a certain amount of double-standard. I used to be a "pro-choice liberal", too. Now I'm a "pro-choice, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving moderate". Hey! That's me!! (well, almost). I'm a "Pro-life, pro-gun, anti-corrupt-government raving Libertarian." This discussion about the porno-cop really is at the heart of the matter. I believe (bet you do, too) that a persons rights extend to the outstretched arms of their neighbor. Did this guy mess with anyone elses world? That's the only real question. He didn't directly cause any damage I guess. I'm just gigantically afraid of what he has the potential to become. You've outed me as a witch-hunter. Thanks a lot. Don't feel bad, I'm about 4 rows back. -Mark
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Andrew Rothman
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Post subject: Re: WI Officer Pleads Guilty To Possessing Child Porn Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:14 pm |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:24 am Posts: 6767 Location: Twin Cities
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